When Exactly..

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turtbub
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Re: When Exactly..

Post by turtbub » Sun Aug 21, 2005 9:30 pm

So let's say I'm with someone I know and we start fooling around and before I know it, we're having sex. I'm in the middle of it so why should I just throw him off of me? Does it mean I haven't done it? Does it mean I haven't lost my virginity? No.



You still are alright in your mind with having sex on some level. Even if you're drunk or whatever. It wasn't forced on you.



A person who's raped doesn't "do" anything. Except try NOT to do anything.



I think virginity is an emotional thing. And I have said multiple times that yes, technically, a person who was raped is no longer a version because they have had intercourse.



But it is in NO way a mental taking away of the virginity and their first time when it's their choice is their real first time.



I won't budge from that idea.
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Re: When Exactly..

Post by !XogFog » Mon Aug 22, 2005 12:15 am

Originally posted by turtbub@Aug 21 2005, 06:30 PM

So let's say I'm with someone I know and we start fooling around and before I know it, we're having sex. I'm in the middle of it so why should I just throw him off of me? Does it mean I haven't done it? Does it mean I haven't lost my virginity? No.



You still are alright in your mind with having sex on some level. Even if you're drunk or whatever. It wasn't forced on you.



A person who's raped doesn't "do" anything. Except try NOT to do anything.



I think virginity is an emotional thing. And I have said multiple times that yes, technically, a person who was raped is no longer a version because they have had intercourse.



But it is in NO way a mental taking away of the virginity and their first time when it's their choice is their real first time.



I won't budge from that idea.

[right][/right]

[/b]


Actually, that's the first time in this thread you've mentioned this concept of two separate virginities.
G-d is not a man, that He should be deceitful, nor a son of man that He should change His mind. (Numbers 23:19)



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Re: When Exactly..

Post by 309756 » Mon Aug 22, 2005 1:09 am

Wow.



Well, I think that there's many different kinds of virginity, as evidenced--for example, Elbereth, does mutual masturbation count as lust and therefore sex as well?



And a question to turtbub: If the physical status of a girl's body is such that she is not a virgin, then she may still retain her virginity?



And finally: What is the physical determinant of virginity? We know it is not the breaking of the hymen... it is not the actual act of penetration... so what is it?

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Re: When Exactly..

Post by Kit » Mon Aug 22, 2005 1:41 am

***My opinion***



You loose your virginity when you have ACTUAL sex. If you're raped - yes I would say that you're not a virgin physically, but mentally you are because you haven't done anything wrong. Does G-d go by the intent or the devestating event that wasn't intended? How could/would he consider it a sin if you had no control?
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Re: When Exactly..

Post by Beautiful » Mon Aug 22, 2005 5:29 am

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Re: When Exactly..

Post by !XogFog » Mon Aug 22, 2005 6:18 am

Everyone here seems to be operating on the idea that not being a virgin is a bad thing. Yeah, if you're having pre-marital sex it's bad, but if you get raped you can't be blamed for it. Being a virgin or not being a virgin carries no baggage of good or bad. It's what you do with it.
G-d is not a man, that He should be deceitful, nor a son of man that He should change His mind. (Numbers 23:19)



The fear of the L-RD is the beginning of knowledge; foolish ones scorn wisdom and discipline. (Proverbs 1:7)

The beginning of wisdom is to aquire wisdom; from your every acquisition acquire understanding. (Proverbs 4:7)



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Re: When Exactly..

Post by Beautiful » Mon Aug 22, 2005 6:29 am

Originally posted by !XogFog@Aug 22 2005, 05:18 AM

Everyone here seems to be operating on the idea that not being a virgin is a bad thing. Yeah, if you're having pre-marital sex it's bad, but if you get raped you can't be blamed for it. Being a virgin or not being a virgin carries no baggage of good or bad. It's what you do with it.

[right][/right]



I don't think not being a virgin is a bad thing. And I don't think rape counts as losing your virginity, either. *Like hannah said*
Little Miss F*cker,

Don't Move An Inch

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I looked at myself

So many things I hate in me

So many things are so hard to believe

I can hear the whole world calling me

Used to be all that i wanted

You to see all that i you to be

does anyone care




Add me.

myspace

*Jamie*



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Re: When Exactly..

Post by turtbub » Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:48 am

I don't think that you can lose your virginity when it's forced on you. Technically, maybe.


(Another time I talked about the two seperate virginities).


And a question to turtbub: If the physical status of a girl's body is such that she is not a virgin, then she may still retain her virginity?


Yes. I think virginity (though literally defined as physical intercourse) is emotional and mental. A girl who was raped is still a virgin both emotionally and mentally because she didn't CHOOSE to have sex, it was forced on her. She had no say in it.


Everyone here seems to be operating on the idea that not being a virgin is a bad thing. Yeah, if you're having pre-marital sex it's bad, but if you get raped you can't be blamed for it. Being a virgin or not being a virgin carries no baggage of good or bad. It's what you do with it.


A girl who's been raped is going to be devastated, and she will be even more devastated if someone tells her that she's no longer a virgin. Because virginity is a very special thing.





Maybe that doesn't make sense to anyone but me, but to me it's blatantly obvious.
"Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall." Confucius



Romans 5:8 "God demonstrates His own love toward us in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."



"If you judge people, you have no time to love them." Mother Theresa



"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." Sir Winston Churchill



There is no revenge so complete as forgiveness.

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Re: When Exactly..

Post by 309756 » Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:42 am

I agree that there is more than one kind of virginity--but does it make nonvirgins somehow inferior?



I mean, that's kinda... exclusionary.

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Re: When Exactly..

Post by !XogFog » Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:15 am

Originally posted by pandasandpenguins@Aug 22 2005, 10:42 PM

I agree that there is more than one kind of virginity--but does it make nonvirgins somehow inferior?



I mean, that's kinda... exclusionary.

[right][/right]



That's what I'm getting at: I view this as just a status, not a judgement.
G-d is not a man, that He should be deceitful, nor a son of man that He should change His mind. (Numbers 23:19)



The fear of the L-RD is the beginning of knowledge; foolish ones scorn wisdom and discipline. (Proverbs 1:7)

The beginning of wisdom is to aquire wisdom; from your every acquisition acquire understanding. (Proverbs 4:7)



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Re: When Exactly..

Post by Rose'nShannenRox » Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:41 am

virginity is a state of mind
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Re: When Exactly..

Post by Glitter » Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:28 pm

Ok First off I'm sorry if I repeat something I didn't readevery single reply. I'm Catholic number one or well at least that is what I've been taught (touchy subject don't agree with ALOT of stuff). But in the Catholic tradition, I'm not sure if it's considered losing you're virginity or not but it's a sin to even think lustful thoughts about the opposit sex. So that then I guess means even oral is out. But this is also coming from the tradition that having sex outside of marriage is a sin (as well as others I know Catholic isn't the only one). But another interesting point is that any form of contraception is also a sin because it eliminates the main aspect of sex, that is pro-creation. and shouldn't be done for pleasure. So ya take my ranting for what it's worth. IM if you wanna know more aim: innocentdoll87

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